Meet Dean Lindquist

Anna Donovan: Hello everyone. This is season 5 of Applying Yourself. My name is Anna Donovan. I am a director of admissions at WashU Law in St. Louis. And we are thrilled to be back and have what I think is an amazing first guest to kick off this season. Today, I will be interviewing and talking with Dean Stefanie Lindquist, who has been here at WashU Law for the last year.

A little background before we get started. Dean Lindquist came to us here at WashU Law from ASU, Arizona State University, where she was the senior vice president for global academic initiatives. She also served as the associate dean at the University of Texas School of Law and was a visiting professor at the University of Southern California Gould School of Law. Before her tenure at University of Texas, Dean Lindquist taught law and political science at Vanderbilt University. She earned her law degree at Temple University and a PhD with an emphasis on American politics, public law, and public administration from the University of South Carolina. She is known for her expertise in judicial behavior and constitutional law. And she has co-authored three books and authored numerous influential publications.

Welcome, Dean Lindquist, to our podcast. So happy to have you here. Jumping right in, how has your summer been?

Stefanie Lindquist: My summer was terrific. I spent a goodly part of it at my farm in Pennsylvania. As most of the faculty and staff and students know at WashU, I own a farm in Pennsylvania where I raise goats and sheep, a couple of pigs, and a goodly number of hens. And so this summer was spent managing some health issues with a couple of my sheep. And otherwise, harvesting my orchard, which is pears, peaches, and apples. The apples are just coming in now. And otherwise enjoying the beauty of the Pennsylvania countryside where I was born and raised. That is, the farm is right near where the town that I was raised in. So it’s a real family affair situation there. So I spent some good time there and the peace of the farm.

And the farm, to me, is very special also because I’m a constitutional law scholar, and the farm was built in the Revolutionary War era and was finally sort of completed by three German immigrants who were veterans of the War of 1812. And so there’s a lot of history there at the farm, and it resonates with this constitutional law professor who cares so much about the development of our constitution in the 18th century.

Anna Donovan: Yeah, excellent. I remember when I think we first got news that the dean search was successful and that you had accepted the position. And I think I distinctly remember one of the first emails we got was a picture of your goats. And I think that, do they have like a certain type of name? Were they all named after flowers?

Stefanie Lindquist: Yeah, they’re all, I have eight goats. They’re Nubian goats. Five were born on the farm. Nothing is cute as the little baby kid, let me tell you. And they’re all named after flowers. And so I do have, my biggest goat is a male goat, and much to his chagrin, his name is Honeysuckle.

Anna Donovan: I love it. It was wonderful. No goats on campus, unfortunately, or maybe for the better.

So I think I mentioned this up top, if I didn’t, I’ll reiterate. So you have been with us for just a little over a year here at WashU Law, and what a year it’s been. Went by really quickly. I don’t know how it felt in the time for you, but kind of looking back on this year, how was it joining us here at WashU Law? How did the first year go?

Stefanie Lindquist: Well, you know, you all can assess, you know, how it went from the dean’s office. But from my standpoint, it was really a wonderfully productive year. I came in with a real agenda, particularly focused on artificial intelligence, and we made major strides there, and I’m happy to talk to you more about that. But in general, the first year was delightful from my standpoint. It is a law school full of incredibly committed professionals and faculty who care so much about the students, and I think the ethos at WashU, both the law school and the university in general, is one that really focuses on our students as individuals. And there is the lore that we know all students by name and by story, and I think that’s really true.

The other thing I found compelling about the first year was meeting our alumni, many of whom are multi-generational WashU graduates. And, you know, there are WashU law graduates and our alumni cohort that have great grandparents that went to WashU Law School, and it’s been a really beautiful thing to see that sort of genealogical trail of WashU law graduates through families. And many of these families, you know, also have graduates from other schools and colleges on WashU’s campus, and they are just very dedicated to the institution. I think that’s why the institution has thrived through challenging times as many other universities have, but I think WashU has maintained its very welcoming, warm, and family feel to the institution. So I really enjoyed my first year.

I also really have been struck by the international climate in the law school with students, I think the last we checked, was from more than 24 countries, and so no matter where you go within the law school, you’re going to engage, going to encounter someone with a different perspective and a global perspective that I think makes the law school unique.

Anna Donovan: Yeah, excellent. It’s really nice to kind of hear that said back for someone who is new, you know, and looking at your bio, someone who’s been a part of so many great other academic institutions. I went to WashU for undergrad, not law school, and I’ve worked in admissions for 15 years, and so it’s nice to hear someone coming in and what I think, you know, the things we care about and do really well, but that you also kind of experienced that in your first year here and are contributing to, you know, the success of all of those things.

So one of, but I’d say probably the top kind of, you know, tagline and something that we are putting out there is that WashU is where creative legal minds are set in motion. If you could talk for just a minute about kind of what that means to you, the concept, and sort of how we are putting that into day-to-day practice at WashU Law.

Stefanie Lindquist: Sure. That is a new tagline that we created for the law school because we wanted to tell a story about what’s actually happening in the building. We are not a status quo-oriented institution. We are one that’s looking to the future to understand how the practice of law is going to change and how the profession is changing, and it’s changing very quickly. So we want to make sure that creativity is at the center of all that we do because students, when they graduate, are going to have to be creative as they navigate the new world that’s being created by legal technologies, artificial intelligence, and other dynamic changes that are taking place in the practice of law.

And so we really wanted to, through the tagline, focus on creativity rather than, you know, learning something by rote because creativity is what’s going to set WashU law students apart from their peers when they go into the job market.

And I mentioned earlier that artificial intelligence is something that’s really at the center of how we’re thinking about the future of law practice. We have initiated a number of different programs to ensure that our students, when they get into either the practice of law or a clerkship or a nonprofit organization or corporation, that they are the go-to person to understand how to use these technologies. And they then become the center of the conversation. And that’s really, really important.

I don’t think many law schools are where we are. Most law schools are thinking about artificial intelligence and technology in terms of the threat it poses to traditional legal educational methods. I’m certainly, you know, a fan of the Socratic method, but we need to think past those sort of ethical constraints, which are important and something we need to consider, and leapfrog to the new reality, which is being shaped by artificial intelligence.

And so we have built a new AI collaborative at the law school to house all of these programs and initiatives that we’re developing, and they span the gamut from high school educational programming to rising 1L programming, to training for all of our faculty, students and staff, to continuing legal education for our alums and other lawyers in the community, to judicial training. And we’re now building a global coalition of universities around the world who are interested in thinking about adapting to this new reality. And we’re planning a summit at a major law firm’s offices in Dubai in January to bring those universities together to talk about how we can be at the cutting edge.

We’ve also invited technology companies into the law school to train our students. So, in the same way that in the 70s, 80s, well, 80s and 90s really, it would have been, you know, sort of educational malpractice not to have Lexis and Westlaw in a law school with students training on those. It is now, in my opinion, educational malpractice not to have some of the leading AI-powered technology companies in our building, and that includes companies like Spellbook, Harvey, Relativity, and others. And so we’re working with all those companies to be sure that they can provide demonstrations to our students and our students can test them out, and indeed, even launch them as part of our curriculum in various courses. And of course, we’re also transforming our curriculum with a number of courses. For example, we just launched one for this semester called AI and the Judiciary, co-taught by an expert in artificial intelligence law and a member of the DC Judiciary.

Anna Donovan: Excellent. I know we, in admissions, are really fortunate to kind of maybe, maybe soft launch, you know, some of these initiatives over our admitted student weekend, and, you know, some of this was incorporated to orientation that we just held for our first-year students. And I know we are so excited in admissions to have all of these things to talk about with prospective students and how we attract the best law students here to WashU Law with all that their legal education can offer.

Stefanie Lindquist: Well, I do think, you know, one of the things I neglected to mention, and I shouldn’t have, is that the staff at WashU is focused on being as innovative as possible. In fact, as you know, Anna, we had an innovation challenge this spring. I’m reviewing all of those proposals now. Frankly, they were all so good. I’m trying to figure out how to allocate resources to be sure that all of them can be implemented. Many of them do use AI for chatbots to discuss, you know, admissions issues with students, admitted students, and things like that, but, or prospective students.

But I also want to point out that it’s not just the faculty that are focusing on artificial intelligence in the building. It’s the staff, and the staff really have, we have an incredibly professionalized organization. In fact, I ran into a Masters of Legal Studies student on the way in to the office this morning, and I, his name is Jonathan. I introduced myself, and he did too. And I asked him how his experience was, and he said, I just want to say that there is a real high caliber of people working in this building. And I couldn’t agree with him more. We are fortunate.

Anna Donovan: For sure. And you know, as a staff member, I feel really fortunate with the opportunity to learn more about both how we can incorporate technology and AI in admissions, but also in the ways that we need to be able to speak to these prospective students and you know, kind of show them all that their legal education and what it can hold if they choose WashU Law for law school.

You touched on this, I think, just a few minutes ago, but this is, and please correct me if I have this wrong, this will be the, is the second year that we’re hosting Legal Tech Week at WashU Law, which is super exciting. Can you tell us a little bit about how that came about and sort of what, I guess, maybe students, faculty and staff can expect from, I think, probably week of exciting events and speakers?

Stefanie Lindquist: Sure. It’s actually Legal Tech Weeks. So when I came on board, it’s actually two events I’d like to talk with you about. One is Legal Tech Weeks, and the other is the Model Constitutional Convention that we’re gonna be hosting in the spring. I’ll tell you about that in a second.

But the last year when I came on board, I realized we needed to pivot to this, what I call the new landscape of legal in the legal profession. And so we invited some speakers. One was an alum who created his own technology company very creatively. Again, there’s a lot of creativity that goes into these identifying where there’s a hole that needs to be filled in terms of legal processes, firm engagement with clients, whatever the case may be. And we have some incredibly creative alumni who have figured out technological ways to advance firms’ interests and lawyers’ interests.

But so we invited him to give a speech, and we had one other speaker, and we called it Legal Tech Week, because we wanted an umbrella to put over it to highlight our focus in this area. This year we had so many events planned that we had to stretch it into two weeks. And so, for example, we’re hosting a gentleman named Bob Ambrosio, who’s a lawyer who is the leading journalist in the area of law and legal tech, who produces a weekly and sometimes biweekly newsletter about the technology industry in law. He’s coming to speak to us. We have demonstrations of a number of different technology platforms for students to learn about. We have multiple panels about privacy in technology, about copyright and legal tech, and AI, about, you know, whether or not and to what extent artificial intelligence is going to crowd out lawyers and how we sort of navigate around that, that consideration. So just a number of different panels and guests at the law school over a two-week period and a lot of activity ongoing. We’re having a trivia night as well. So that’s really mushroomed because of the connections we’ve built through an advisory board and through our global partners, et cetera, who now offer us all kinds of interesting people to invite.

Anna Donovan: Excellent.

Stefanie Lindquist: So I think it’s going to be really wonderful for the students to hear from some of these entrepreneurs, chief innovation officers, technology CEOs, and things like that.

Anna Donovan: Yeah, yeah. And tell us about a model constitution.

Stefanie Lindquist: Yes, so this year or next year is the, yeah, next year is the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence, not the Constitution, but it’s a perfect year to host what is going to be the second National Model Constitutional Convention. The first I hosted at Arizona State. It was the first of its kind. And it’s a nationwide convention in which students from undergraduate institutions and law schools and also graduate students are invited to represent states, their delegates, from the 50 states and the territories to discuss, to propose and debate and potentially adopt amendments to the United States Constitution.

And we did it over the Memorial Day weekend last year in Phoenix. It’s a three-day event. It’s governed by Robert’s Rules of Order. We have the former president of the American Association of Parliamentarians that comes to help students understand how to operate under the Robert’s Rules. And so it’s a very formal but very, very effective way for students from across the country to meet, to engage with each other, to talk about flaws in the Constitution, how to correct those through constitutional amendments.

And so we raise, it’s an expensive operation because it involves hosting more than 100 students and also flying them to the location and putting them up for three days and all that and the food and everything else. And so we were successful in fundraising what we needed to from the John Storr Foundation and from the Frick Foundation here at WashU. And so now we are launching that and invitations or at least the application process will be open soon. So anyone who’s listening to this, if you’re interested in the Model Constitutional Convention and joining us as a delegate, it’s one of the most exciting experiences I’ve ever had in my life. And I wasn’t even a delegate, but we welcome you to apply.

Anna Donovan: Yeah, and I should probably do my due diligence. I think for Legal Tech Weeks, this would be a great opportunity for anyone who’s looking to visit WashU Law, considering applying to come and participate and see some of these speakers and see some of these panels and to start kind of getting involved.

Stefanie Lindquist: Yes, these are open to the public and certainly to any students interested in going to WashU. We welcome you in.

Anna Donovan: Yeah, absolutely. We will wrap up here in just a second, but you’ve accomplished so much over this one year and you have brought so much. And we appreciate you bringing so many things over from ASU here to WashU Law and to see where we can go to next.

We typically end our podcasts touching on something about St. Louis. You are a new St. Louisan. We have adopted you. But I wondered if you could tell a little bit about your transition to St. Louis, but how your time is spent here, and if you have any recommendations or kind of highlights for people who didn’t know much about St. Louis like yourself and may find themselves here and what they should do or go see.

Stefanie Lindquist: Yeah. Well, it will come as no surprise to your listeners that I spend most of my time inside the law school. Being a dean is a, it is beautiful. It’s the best. It’s the most beautiful law school building I think I might have ever seen.

But St. Louis is a neat city, and I’ve really enjoyed getting to know it. I like to play golf and there’s a 27 holes of golf you can play in Forest Park. And so I go over there and play from time to time. I’m a, well, this is gonna make me sound like a middle-aged lady, which I am. I am an avid jazzerciser, and so there’s lots of exercise opportunity. I do that a lot. I like to bowl. I was just bowling at the Tropicana lanes this weekend. And so if you’re interested in sort of physical activities like I like to do, there’s lots of stuff to do, lots of places to go. There’s a lot of great pinball. I’m a big pinball fan, a lot of places to play pinball here. It’s just it’s really fun.

A lot of wonderful restaurants, a lot of wonderful communities. I think one thing people don’t understand or may not know if they haven’t been to St. Louis, is the sort of small villagey type communities that are all across and around the city and around the university. And I happened to live in the Central West End, and that is just a lovely community of shops and condos and beautiful homes, wonderful restaurants and bars and open seating areas that it’s just a beautiful place to live, and I feel very fortunate to be here.

I consider myself lucky to have a rural home in Pennsylvania that I get to visit every once in a while where I get to shovel manure out of a barn, and let me tell you, that’s a good thing if you’re a dean. You can get way too much up in your head. But then I get to come back to the city and enjoy what is a city full of just intense American history here, the confluence of two rivers, an incredibly important port city, one that was unbelievably important in the development or in the industrialization of the United States. St. Louis is a very, very special place, and I think anyone who comes to WashU to visit, to take a look at the law school, I think you’ll find it to be the same. And we look forward, for those of you who are listening and thinking about going to WashU, we look forward to introducing you to our beautiful city, too.

Anna Donovan: Excellent. Thank you so much.

Stefanie Lindquist: My pleasure.

Anna Donovan: We so appreciate having you on our podcast, kicking off our new season. And thank you again for joining us. And I guess that’s great.

Stefanie Lindquist: It’s my good fortune to be dean of this magnificent law school and work with people like you, Anna. Thank you so much.

Anna Donovan: Thanks. Excellent. Okay. Goodbye.